Trigger warning: This story contains mentions of sexual violence
Max: So, my name is Max, I’m 19 years old, I was born here at Lviv oblast, in small town named Zhydachiv, but later I moved to another region named Rivne oblast and almost for 12 years I lived here before moving.
Vic: Thank you. So, where were you living at the start of the full-scale invasion?
Max: At Rivne. I was in the 10th grade of school. So just the second half of the year, start of the high school, and… (pause) It was not that scary or loud in my city because Rivne doesn’t have any major factories or airfields or any others. But we do heard bombings and shellings of cities around us, because there [are] a lot or strategic cities around Rivne. So it was not as disturbing and scary for me like for my friends that live in much more dangerous regions like Valeria (Valeria’s story) or my girlfriend.
Vic: So, did you… you didn’t get any air raid sirens or anything where you lived at first?
Max: No, all that we heard was just bombings… bombings and our planes from our airfields that flied up to intercept missiles from russia and belarus.
Vic: How did you get your news about what was happening at the start?
Max: My mom had pretty intense feelings that something bad [was] going to happen, so she didn’t sleep all night.
Vic: Like before it?
Max: Yeah. She monitored the news in russia and Ukraine and… before I was going to sleep, she was talking about that something is going to happen, and… (laughs) I calmed down her that nothing is going to happen, but then she was right. She woke me and my brother up at 6 am in the morning because she heard bombings of nearby cities and read the news. Also we were contacting all our relatives, we have pretty big family, so relatives in Western Ukraine, in South Ukraine, in Central Ukraine, so we heard a lot of different stories. Some of our relatives were tra… one of our relatives were trapped in the city at Kyiv oblast. And others, like my cousins were pretty much… not much affected by the war because he lived in Uzhhorod, in Zakarpattia oblast. So he woke up at 11 am. Any my mom was very scared and panicked at the whole situation, so… so she decided that we need to move to our grandma that lived here, at Lviv oblast, because Rivne is less than… or near the 100 km from belarus border.
Vic: Yeah, it’s up north, isn’t it?
Max: Yes, so she was scared that if they start the invasion from north, then the city will be occupied, so we rushed here with our whole family. First weeks we were quite… we were quite positive that it will end soon, cause there was a lot of positive news like… some of the columns of their [russian] army was bombarded or some about their attacks failed and the story about taking the Borispol [Boryspil] airfield, when they had quite a huge failure trying to take the airfield. But… at the first we were scared a lot about air raids, every siren we… we were going to the basement to hide, and… but the first… but at the time there was no, uh, shellings or bombings at the Western Ukraine. Uh…
Vic: So, how did you get your news about what was happening with the column headed towards Kyiv?
Max: From Telegram. I was in a car while we headed to our grandma, I was reading all the headlines about what was happening.
Vic: Okay. Did you see stories of Ukrainians, ordinary Ukrainians, not military people, trying to help protect Kyiv?
Max: Yeah, I heard them from uh… almost from, well from people that knew them, because we had relatives that lived in Kyiv oblast, so they told a lot of stories about what was happening. And a lot of disturbing stories.
Vic: Can you give me examples of what Ukrainians were doing, like, non-military Ukrainians were doing to try and help protect Kyiv?
Max: A lot of Ukrainians in the Kyiv oblast were making the Molotovs [Molotov cocktails] to intercept columns, and some of them even made, uh… self-made bombs. Yeah.
Vic: To put in the roads, or…?
M: Just throw them at the vehicles and tanks.
Vic: (laughs) Okay, thanks.
Max: One… I know that in one city, they… when they, uh, when the russians got close, they abandoned two tanks and people rushed to pour fuel in them and drove them away (both laugh). When the russians came back they saw that two tanks went missing and after that, one of the tanks found, uh… was found in the garage of 80-year-old man.
Vic: So he just stole it and kept it? (laughs)
Max: Yeah. After that he handed to the… our military because there was a huge reward for it.
Vic: Oh, yeah. So… do stories like that, the guy who stole the tank, do you talk about them with your friends? Like when they were happening?
Max: Yeah, it was… it was very good for our morale, because those stories made us believe that we will stand and we will not fall. Under the pressure.
Vic: Yeah, that’s understandable. Um, can you tell me what happened with the russians trying to capture the airport?
Max: Uh… the first attempt they were successful. They landed with the… uh, attack helicopters and transport helicopters, and delivered their спецназ [special operations forces] and other… eh… soldiers, and our… oud [soldiers] made tactical retreat. And after that, well, while doing that, some of our… eh… men from military shoot down several helicopters. Those was K-52 or Mi-24. And after all our men retreated from there, the artillery shelled the whole airport and destroyed the airfield and destroyed some of the helicopters. After that, our army made a tactical comeback to, uh, destroy what was left, because they, their [russian] army had the idea that they’ll capture the airfield and their transport planes will land there.
Vic: And the column will meet them.
Max: Yes. And to, uh, make their effect stronger, our army blowed all bridges around the airfield.
Vic: And how did that story make you feel as it was developing?
Max: I was very proud or our tacticians and of how they outsmarted and lured their [russian] army into the trap.
Vic: Did you hear about the Ghost of Kyiv?
Max: Yeah! At first, everyone was thinking that it was about one pilot, but later on we discovered that it was a code name for group of pilots working over Kyiv.
Vic: Did you hear about a pilot called Juice at all?
Max: Yeah.
Vic: So he’s different to Ghost of Kyiv, or…?
Max: Yeah. From what I heard it’s different pilot, because those pilots that were in the Ghost of Kyiv group, their names are kept in secret. And their planes have pretty neat camouflage.
Vic: Did you discuss Ghost of Kyiv with your friends much?
Max: Yea. Me and my friends are quite interested in planes and, uh… vehicles in general, we were quite interested in that… was it group of pilots, because…?
Vic: Yeah, yeah, squadron.
Max: Squadron. And we’re, again, very proud of our people.
Vic: Do you think it would have been more impactful if you knew the names of the pilots?
Max: No, I think it’s better that they kept it secret because I believe that their lives would be at risk.
Vic: Would you say it’s mainly younger people that were in the Ghost of Kyiv? Or is it everyone?
Max: I think it, it worked for everyone as everyone worked together and done what they could to help the military and stop the invasion.
Vic: Can you think of any other characters from around that sort of time, like stories of people who were fighting russia?
Max: (laughs) I remember one guy with cigarettes that was throwing mines at the road. It was a video of a man where he, where he carried a landmine in the hand while holding a cigarette in his mouth.
Vic: (laughs) Nice. So was that on social media?
Max: Yeah.
Vic: Okay. I guess people like that, they… you don’t know their name, it’s just a video of someone doing this, and… yeah. Cool.
Max: Well, a lot of people admired soldiers that were shooting helicopters or planes of russia.
Vic: Did it, um, has it ever made you want to sign up to the military, seeing these military heroes?
Max: Yeah, a lot. I was quite hyped to sign and join them and help to reclaim our land and defend our people.
Vic: But I guess, you are so young that…
Max: (laughs)
Vic: Yeah. (laughs)
Max: We have a base here and 80… um… you know, the type of military that drop out of the planes?
Vic: Oh, like paratroopers?
Max: Yeah yeah, paratrooper division! So everyone here in Lviv oblast was quite hyped to sign to them, because it was like, we were very proud of them as they were leading a lot of operations, making landings and clearing the way for others.
Vic: So do you hear a lot of stories about what they’re doing?
Max: Yeah. Because some of people from my town were in that division.
Vic: Do they personally talk about what they’re doing or do you just generically have news about it?
Max: They were just generic news because we were trying to not talk a lot about it because we were scared that russians might track our… our texts or just calls, and… and have some tactical information from them.
Vic: Did that discourage you from talking about the war in general at all?
Max: I just thought that… as long as I’m not talking about some intel or another information that might be valuable to them, there’s nothing to be scared about.
Vic: Yeah, fair enough. So was there anything else that gave you hope at the start of the war, other than these stories of people, like, doing their part throwing Molotov’s [cocktails] at the column of throwing mines?
Max: A lot of their [russian army’s] failures as the… so-called ‘traffic jam’ at the road to Kyiv, where a lot of their columns were caught in jam and then destroyed by our military.
Vic: I heard that they had problems where someone in the russian military supply chain had been stealing money that was supposed to be for better tires, and so they all had terrible tires and kept blowing up.
Max: And they were low on fuel… and other things. And the funniest thing is, uh… Chornobayivka airfield. When they proceeded to take airfield for 8 times in a row and then get destroyed by our military [each time].
Vic: That’s interesting that they would keep trying that many times. Would you say that people talk more about stories of russian failure or Ukrainian success?
Max: I think both. They were laughing from their [russian army’s] failures and admiring our success.
Vic: Were there any, um, I guess smaller or more personal russian failures, like, were there stories of a specific russian person doing something really stupid, or was it more broad?
Max: It was more in general, something about some persons… Eh, it was later, in the second or third year of the [full-scale] war, in our media were very popular videos of how russians were captured doing some… pretty questionable things while our drones flied over to them.
Vic: Oh… like… what have the drones seen?
Max: Eh… how two… (laughs) I don’t know if I can tell about it…
Vic: Two russians in love?
Max: Uh-huh. Something like that. Or… um… high-ranking soldiers making low-rank soldiers pleasure them while threatening them with weapons or other things.
Vic: Yeah… Um, so going back to stories of Ukrainian success earlier at the war, of ordinary civillians fighting, have you hear stories like that more recently, like in the past 2 years?
Max: Past 2 years… Well… The operation “Spiderweb”, when our forces made a huge spy operation to deploy drones in russia and destroy a huge amount of strategic bombers that were attacking Ukraine with missiles.
Vic: Is that the one where it was in the truck and they got it like…?
Max: Yes, yes.
Vic: And then the russians killed the truck driver. I remember that. Do you hear stories…
Max: And also today there was an… some ships, of the russian ships, were bombarded.
Vic: Oh, today?
Max: Yeah. I can even find the videos.
Vic: (laughs) Yeah, it’s interesting how there’s videos available of so much stuff now.
Max: Well, it’s to make people proud and to make them believe in the… in the… in our, that we can win. (shows a video)
Vic: Oh? Where’s that?
Max: That is…
Vic: Somewhere in the russia I guess.
Max: Yes, in the russia, some of the… blown some of the ships, raider vehicles, some of the, uh, anti-air defense systems and sone of the equipment used to transport oil.
Vic: Oh, nice. Have you heard any more stories of individual people’s actions? Like I’ve seen sometimes there’s stories of babusias [grandmas], like, trying to poison russians and things like that.
Max: Yeah, there are a lot of stories like that. And… some of them even tried to choke them [russians] in sleep.
Vic: A little babusia [grandma] trying to choke them?
Max: Yeah. Or just poison the water or somehow contact our military so they can ambush them [russians].
Vic: Do you hear those types of stories much nowadays? Or were they earlier?
Max: Hmm… I haven’t heard any of those stories now.
Vic: Okay. Can you tell me about Pes Patron?
Max: (laughs) It is a charming talisman of our forces, energetic dog. It became a meme, even I… every time I and my friends, when me and my friends see an Jack Terrier dog we yell “Pes Patron!”.
Vic: Does it make you want to get one?
Max: No, cause I’m afraid of dogs.
Vic: Oh. But you still like Pes Patron?
Max: Yes.
Vic: He is very cute. Have you ever thought of buying, like, any Pes Patron merchandise? I keep seeing T-shirts and socks and bags.
Max: Well I think it’s more suitable for children as those things… were mostly made to cheer up children as they were very affected by the whole situation.
Vic: So you think the marketing of Pes Patron has been aimed a bit more towards children?
Max: Yeah. I think it was to make them less stressed about the whole situation, to shift their attention from war to some awesome little pal.
Vic: Does Pes Patron appear on, like, news and stuff a lot?
Max: In the early stage of war, yes, but now it’s, like, once a year, I think.
Vic: Okay. So he’s not doing a media tour?
Max: (laughs) Yeah.
Vic: I saw that he met Zelenskyy. Are there any other, I guess, characters or noteworthy people that you can think of, that people have spoken about and shared in social media that inspired hope?
Max: Well I think… besides all people and persons that we talked already, there is only some stories of people that fallen defending, while defending, out that made some heroic moves.
Vic: Do you tend to discuss those people a lot?
Max: Yeah. Because it’s, it’s, uh… because we need to remember them and remember what they have done, and respect them.
Vic: I’ve seen, at Rynok ploscha, they’ve got the boards with the photographs and information about the people. And people leave flowers and food.
Max: Yeah, we’ve got… I think every small town got board like that where people honour their… people that lived with them. Yeah.
Vic: So it’s quite common in towns for them to have the boards?
Max: Yeah.
Vic: Okay. That’s all the questions I have. If you’ve got anything else you want to share, or…
Max: Um… besides that, I only got disturbing stories from Kyiv region, when there, when there was, when they was under control of russia.
Vic: I mean, you can share if you’d like, but I don’t want to, like, push you. You know.
Max: I could tell ‘em, but I don’t know if you could publish them, because they very very disturbing.
Vic: Go for it.
Max: In town where our relatives lived, there… the head of the church deceived people into handing their children to him and then he transferred them to russia cause he was collaborating with their church. And a lot of civilians were killed mercilessly and for no reason. There was a story about a family that were hiding in the basement and their kid ran out in the basement to take their cat to them and the russians killed him in front of his family while they were sitting in the basement watching this. But… also I have stories about couples in distance that were… like… the boy had a chance to move out to the city before russians came but his girlfriend was still in the city, and russians made her call to him on a videocall and threaten that if she didn’t pleasure them they would kill him, kill her in front of him. And the more disturbing story I think is when the russians locked up a young mother with her 6-year-old child and raped her in front of him. Our family members say that the child… gray, the hair turned gray from the shock. So there was a lot of stories like that.
Vic: So you’re discussing them… like, your family members are telling you these ones?
Max: Just telling them about once, and…
Vic: Yeah, not a subject to discuss, but a…
Max: Yes. Just to remember how cruel and animal-like are they [russians].
Vic: I guess they had a big impact on you.
Max: Yeah. I think that all of our people, they… it’s a memory to us why we… why are we fighting and what are we fighting for, so that this story will not happen again.
Vic: And do you think stories like that encourage people to sign up to the military?
Max: I think yes. For revenge and to defend people, innocent people from that happening to them.
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