Part 1: Bogdan on his time in captivity: Part 1
Part 2: Bogdan on his time in captivity: Part 2
Part 3: A smoke break with Bogdan
I: Do you feel like it’s history repeating itself, like when you were a kid and you looked after him and took care of him? Now you have an organization and the means to help him while he’s at the front.
B: Yeah, yeah [laughs]
I: Yeah? [laughs]
B: ‘Course. I mean, how else? You know, when the organization is helping folks now, most of whom I aren’t even seen in person. We’ve talked, there’re even cases where we didn’t even talk on WhatsApp, just texting, with the boys asking for help. And here you’ve got your own kin – what, you’re just gonna leave him or what? No, of course not, we’re going to help.
I: [Interpreting to English].
B: About what was said regarding those crates sitting here, this place can also be used as a shelter. That’s why we have to have stocks of some quick-prep food here.
I: [Interpreting to English].
V: As an organization or just in general, do people have to have a shelter that they can go to?
I: [in Ukrainian to Respondent] Is this a requirement for you because you’re an organization? Or is it the law that you have to—
B: No, it’s our own initiative.
I: Ah, [in English] So, it’s their own initiative.
V: Okay.
[Smoke break]
B: I can tell you a bit more about the “Civilian Prisoners of War” organization.
I: [Interpreting to English] If you’re interested.
V: Yeh, yeh.
B: Let’s start, as they say, from the beginning. The whole point of starting the organization was about helping myself, since the state and everything to do with government bodies, local authorities… nobody was interested in our problems and didn’t even have the heart to deal with it. People are quiet – so let ’em be quiet. Let’s leave everyone alone with their own troubles.
I: [Interpreting to English].
B: In 2025, three NGOs for civilian prisoners were set up. One organization is in Zaporizhzhia, “Path to Life.” Another one is also in the Kharkiv region. The territory where they work – that’s Kupyansk, Vovchansk, Lyptsi. We work this side, they work that side [of Kharkiv region]. And our organization. And what’s real interesting is that all three organizations registered within the same week, just on different days.
I: [laughs] That’s crazy! [Interpreting to English].
B: Not that we agreed on it. It’s just that each organization was getting its own papers ready. We all know each other really well, but we didn’t plan the registration time. You know, when the papers were finally ready, the charter, and all the founding meetings were done, and all the rest – it just turned out that the Kharkiv organization registered on August 11th, the Zaporizhzhia one on the 14th, and we did on August 15th.
I: [in English] That’s interesting. [Interpreting to English].
B: After we started up, there was a real nice event [Note: he is being sarcastic and uses a russified term “meropriatie”] we went to. It was the opening of a mental health and rehab center in Zaporizhzhia. Right there, a three-way memorandum on mutual assistance was signed between our three organizations. And I’ll tell you this: if you, say, go to Kharkiv to see our boys and ask them what they need, or go to Zaporizhzhia, or here in Balakliia – the answer’s gonna be pretty much the same for everyone. ‘Cause we talk to each other a lot, go to different events, different trainings.
Look, we registered in 2025, and since then we’ve been to so many different happenings, it’s just unreal. We’re acquainted with all the UN structures. Then, as far as our ombudsman goes and a whole bunch of other organizations in Ukraine that deal with prisoner issues… Plus, we got the CRSV topic (conflict-related sexual violence) real developed. We go round to different international forums, then psychological trainings, facilitation, even helping yourself, which is no small thing. The most interesting part is, if you ask in Balakliia, Kharkiv, or Zaporizhzhia – the answer’s basically the same for all of them.
I: [Interpreting to English].
B: I’ll say this, the main goal for all three organizations is to shed a bit of light on the fact that we’ve got this problem in our society, and there’re folks who suffered from all this. These are normal, living people staying among us. There are some who it hit harder, and they aren’t working with psychologists [therapists]. So, the aim and goal is to get it through to our society that we got this problem. But it’s nothing scary, like, people keep on living, working, helping themselves. [smiles]
I: And people need to be understanding.
B: Yeah.
I: [Interpreting the previous lines to English].
V: Is there a particular social barrier between people who have come out of these situations and the general population? Maybe people are afraid to talk to them because they don’t know what to say, or?
I: [Interpreting to Ukrainian].
B: That’s a really interesting topic. See, there really are barriers. When our members – call them NGO members, beneficiaries, whatever you like – when they don’t work with psychologists, their mental state is real low, real weighed down. And a person gets more aggressive. And when in society, it might even… [long pause] people have these triggers left over after all that [captivity]. And certain things can remind them of it. When something like that happens, for instance, it could be the rustle of a plastic bag. For many, it’s really…
I: Triggering?
B: Yeah. And it just takes ‘em right back into those memories. For us, look: a bag, scotch tape, then water dripping, the sound, you know, when an iron door opens and then bangs shut real hard. And when something like that happens, a person goes back [to that state], then he is no longer in control of himself. And that’s been noticed more than once. That’s why we’re working hard now so that anyone who wants to go through – not courses, but sessions with a psychologist – they’re given absolutely free. It’s individual, free, mostly online, and it’s all confidential with us. It isn’t made public what, say, you, Serhiy, are doing with the psychologist. ‘Cause our society is still a bit backwards – if they hear you’re working with a psychologist, it means you’re some kind of crazy person. That’s how people around here react to it.
I: Yes, that’s true. And people, regular civilians who see that kind of behavior triggered by one thing or another, how do they react? Are they understanding about it?
B: It varies. For example, if a person knows he went through captivity, they’ll still, you know, react more or less okay. ‘Cause anything can happen. But if people don’t know each other, they look at you like you’re some kind of nutcase. And that kills you even more. Before New Year’s, we were at a training in Truskavets [Western Ukraine, near Poland]. At that nice “Mirotel” hotel. While we were there, folks from Kyivstar [Note: one of the largest electronic communications operator in Ukraine] and our medics who do plastic surgery were gathering there too (also for training).
I: What was going on there?
B: Well, let’s just say the medics had a corporate party there, and Kyivstar was meeting too. They were doing their year-end results, plus they had different activities. We were there for 5 days and they were there for 5 days, too. When we got to know each other after a couple days – because we’d run into each other in the spa, then the restaurant, in the elevator, out on walks – well, of course people start talking. And when they finally asked us, like, “Boys, what’d you come here for?” Well, like always, I played dumb and said, “Oh, just came here for a training.” But when we talked a bit more, we said we’re civilian prisoners of war.
There was about, let me tell you, maybe 30 of us there. And when we told them who we were, that these were people who went through captivity – the whole gang of us that came – well, you know, when they first heard “captivity,” they kind of went, whoops, on guard. I said, “It’s all okay, it’s not like we met you on the first day and told you about it. Three days have passed, you see we talk normal, we behave normal, there is no extra aggression. Like, we’re normal, living people.” You know, the most shameful thing is that our society isn’t ready for this. And the government wasn’t ready for it either.
I: The government still isn’t ready. Because they aren’t doing anything to prepare people or explain it to them. There should be some kind of nationwide campaign to prepare people, to talk about it. But we don’t have that.
B: We don’t. We’re workin’ on it.
I: [Starts interpreting to English]–
B: It can even be some smell. It happens very often. Sorry for interrupting you. We just got this one guy who, when he came back after captivity, he pulled away from his wife. And, look, 2022, ’23, ’24. ’25 – is when he finally got to us and we all gathered here. See, when we get together, we act free, we can talk about any topic. And one of the topics for discussion was triggers. There was a presentation, and when they gave an example that one of the triggers could be a smell, and when almost everyone had left, he comes up and tells his situation. When they took him, they beat him first, tied him up, and one of the folks in the car when they were moving him was a woman. And she had this perfume smell, and when he got back home–
[Respondent’s phone rings]
B: Just a sec. I’m a bit busy.
I: [in English] He was interrupted mid-sentence, but [continues interpreting to English]. [in Ukrainian to Respondent] And you were talking about the guy who came up and mentioned the woman. You started saying that in the bus he smelled that perfume on the woman.
B: Yeah, when they were taking him, he said: “That smell stuck in my mind for life.” I told him: “If it’s bothering you, you gotta talk about it. Changing a perfume isn’t a problem.” And thanks to meetings like that, when we get together and talk about what problems someone’s got, what they need right now, a lot gets solved. Because practice has already shown that when we meet and there’s no outsiders in our company, we can talk freely, even have a laugh (now we can laugh) about how someone sat in a cell, who was counting days on the wall, who was writing poems on the walls. It was all different.
These talks and these meetings happen in a peer-to-peer format. He knows that if he tells me, even about this perfume thing, he knows I’m not gonna judge him. I’ll do the opposite, I’ll talk through the situation with him and we’ll find a way out together. That’s really important. Since, again, back to the government not taking this on – we’re organizing ourselves.
I: Yes, they feel safe. Around their own.
B: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I: [in English] Continuing the story about the perfume [Interpreting to English].
B: [in Ukrainian] Also, we’re actively working now so that if we’re invited somewhere to an event, they don’t just invite me, but the family too. ‘Cause with this being a front-line area, when you go somewhere and they stay here, you don’t feel comfortable there. Because you’re constantly checking your phone. Even now, if mine pings, I look to see where things are flying, ‘cause you came to visit us, and we gotta make sure you leave here safe. [laughs] Well, that’s just, you know, it’s already—
I: Automatic.
B: Yeah, yeah. It’s not like I’m specially sitting there watching, no, it’s just—
I: A reflex.
B: Right, right. Well, especially with our security situation, even with the family, it’s important that if you go, they go with you. Our different NGOs and charity funds aren’t ready for this yet either, we’re fighting them for it. For them, it’s extra funding and a bunch of different headaches on that account. I say, look, if you’re inviting us, first off, you’re interested. And you need it. You have to work off your grant money. We got certain conditions. We can dictate them a bit now. That’s why, let’s just say, we’re also looking out for it so not just the boys who went through captivity get sessions with a psychologist, but the family too. Because the family suffered a whole lot in this case as well. Translate that, I’ll add something else.
I: [Interpreting to English] Question: when you were in captivity, what helped you keep going? Maybe it was faith, maybe hope for something, maybe stories of prisoners you’d heard before, some heroes, something like that?
B: When I was in captivity, what helped me keep going? It was probably my life experience – that if you’re alive right now, then everything’s okay. And also I got a degree in psychology. I didn’t let myself get worked up extra, thinking like, okay, it’s all gonna end for me right here. As far as stories about captivity go, it’s not like it’s a story about captivity, but let’s say a full-on case from life. The thing is in 2014, when it all started, we were working in Donbas [Note: it’s a critical industrial and coal-mining region in southeastern Ukraine, comprising the Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts, occupied by russia since 2014], and when the power changed there, and then Ukraine came back, well, we lived through all that there. And cases where people were taken and they came back home alive – I’ve known those since 2014, not since 2022. And, let’s just say, I set myself up with the thought that we’d get back, we’d be fine. And of course, since I went to church as a kid, I knew a few prayers. Faith in God – everyone takes that in their own way, but I take it like He’s there and in one way or another He helps us. Well, something like that.
I: [Interpreting to English].
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